FriarJohn
"Lighten up, Francis."
Reged: 01/11/05
Posts: 18825
Loc: East Helena, Montana
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Granted this is fairly subjective and there are probably very few that have heard all or even most of these but I think we can get a pretty rough scale going. I'm starting this from a few different threads. I propose two subjective measures, overall loudness and sound quality, a 1-10 scale from rappy/barky to deep/thunderous. And this is all subjective and relative and we'll never have 100% agreement, but I think we can get close. Also, this is not a contest. Not everybody wants loud pipes just like not everybody wants quiet. If there's a tie we'll put them on the same line.
Loudest to Quietest (with sound quality rank in parentheses):
Non-Baffled:
Straight pipes, no baffles, e.g. fishtails (5)
Thunderbike, no baffles (8)
Sceptres, no baffles (8)
Specialty Spares, no baffles (9)
Epco, no baffles (2)
D&D, no baffles (4)
Bubs, no baffles (6)
Aftermarket:
Thunderbike (8)
Sceptres (8)
Specialty Spares (9)
Epco (2)
D&D (4)
Bubs (6)
Factory:
Short TORs, gutted (6)
Long TORs, gutted (6)
Stock pipes, completely gutted (7)
Stock pipes, 2 baffles drilled (8)
Stock pipes, 1 baffle drilled (7)
Short TORs (6)
Long TORs (6)
Stock pipes (4)
Discuss (civilly, please). Feel free to reorder, mix and match, etc. Don't get your panties in a bunch when someone disagrees with you. I've heard all of these, I think, but rarely together, so this initial list is just a shot in the dark. Personally I think my Specialty Spares slashcuts (with worn baffles) are some of the loudest pipes around, but don't hold a candle to fishtails. That said, I like the deeper sound of the SS over the fishtails. Also, I've currently got factory pipes split out. That's probably the biggest gap I have in my listening experience. I've only ever heard 2 baffles drilled out of stock pipes, so totally gutted pipes could be the loudest thing out there.
Lastly, if someone has access to a db meter and wants to take it to the next large gathering for some informal testing, that would be most excellent. And it would settle most disputes that are sure to crop up in this discussion. 
Edited by FriarJohn (07/13/11 11:40 AM)
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hyates
Adjunct
Reged: 11/03/09
Posts: 473
Loc: Canada
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Good meaasure of where I sit, so to speak with pipes.
I wonder if there are different TORs though. I have long slash cut TORs for my EFI Speedmaster that seem quite loud. They are straight through with baffles around the circumference. The way the TORS are referred to, you'd think they were relatively quiet. I beg to differ, even with custom earplugs they are more than loud enough.
I'd love to know how these pipes measure up with the new impending SAE J2825 tests that will be coming to some jurisdictions.
CLICKY
H.
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2007 Speedmaster Tornado Red/Black (Hers)
2010 Speedmaster Black/New England White (Mine)
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FriarJohn
"Lighten up, Francis."
Reged: 01/11/05
Posts: 18825
Loc: East Helena, Montana
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I forgot gutted TORs.
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BA.com Caretaker | Friarsride | jb.com
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LKR
Adjunct
Reged: 01/14/05
Posts: 185
Loc: Drayton Valley Alberta, Canada
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Thx for giving my Thunderbike's such a high rating. I ordered a set for my Trophy and the Kiwi's are giving me a a good deal because I was the first one to buy thier Speedmaster pipes in either North America or Canada I can't remember which. You are probably one of the only people on this forum who has heard all of these pipes so I trust your rating.
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FriarJohn
"Lighten up, Francis."
Reged: 01/11/05
Posts: 18825
Loc: East Helena, Montana
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Again, it's not a value judgment and it's not a contest. Loudest doesn't work for everyone. This is more about the characteristics of each set of pipes.
Freedom has a set of Thunderbikes for his Speedmaster but they won't fit on his bike with the Voyager trike kit. I guess I'll be paying more attention to bike exhausts this weekend in Nelson.
I may have to filter all the no-baffle pipes towards the top. I'm pretty sure all of those pipes without baffles would be similarly loud.
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BA.com Caretaker | Friarsride | jb.com
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LKR
Adjunct
Reged: 01/14/05
Posts: 185
Loc: Drayton Valley Alberta, Canada
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If Fredom's pipes are a length problem maybe they will swap him for a set of shorties. I have a set of the stock 2003 Shotgun's and shorty slash cut offroad quiet version. Had a set of the short offroad loud version but they were just obnoxious so I sold them. Freedom if you are listening drop me a line maybe we can work something out.
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FriarJohn
"Lighten up, Francis."
Reged: 01/11/05
Posts: 18825
Loc: East Helena, Montana
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He had his stock pipes cut down. He said he's hanging on to the Thunderbike pipes.
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BA.com Caretaker | Friarsride | jb.com
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Keith
Stickman Yogi
Reged: 03/21/09
Posts: 11611
Loc: BC, Canada
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Quote:
I may have to filter all the no-baffle pipes towards the top. I'm pretty sure all of those pipes without baffles would be similarly loud.
Yeah, I'm thinkin' the same thing. Our SSs without baffles are in effect, straight pipes.
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Live to love, love to live.
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The_Dog33
Fe Butt
Reged: 02/01/07
Posts: 16995
Loc: NE PA USA
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Slash cut stock is louder than tapered cut to long cannons (both gutted completely except the reducer) and the short slash cut JC Whitney are louder than both.
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I learned all I need to know about life by killing smart people and eating their brains.
Eat right ,Exercise ,Stay fit, Die Anyway!
some shots of our bikes
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Conwy
Learned Hand
Reged: 05/21/07
Posts: 1267
Loc: Kent, WA, USA
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One of the reasons I bought the Bubs (way back when) was because someone, here, mentioned that the Bubs were tuned for our bikes.
I do know the tone of the Bubs is far better & deeper than the TORs. They also have more "bark" than TORs. They should be rated at least a 7, if not an 8.
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Blue/White 2007 TBA, Thruxton needles, Unifilter, AI removed, Polaris Bellmouth, Bubs, Nology Coils/wires, Lightbar, Ricor Intiminators, Hagon Nitros, Tall Sissy Bar w/luggage rack, Dart flyscreen & Lowers. 130 Mains.
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FriarJohn
"Lighten up, Francis."
Reged: 01/11/05
Posts: 18825
Loc: East Helena, Montana
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Remember the idea is that more bark would be a lower number.
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BA.com Caretaker | Friarsride | jb.com
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FriarJohn
"Lighten up, Francis."
Reged: 01/11/05
Posts: 18825
Loc: East Helena, Montana
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Massaged the list a bit. Reorganized is more like it. I'm guessing that any of the pipes without any baffles at all would be similarly loud. Just on the loudness scale they may all be the same volume. Where there could be a difference is in the tone. Certainly unbaffled fishtails are more rappy than thunder-y.
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BA.com Caretaker | Friarsride | jb.com
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Conwy
Learned Hand
Reged: 05/21/07
Posts: 1267
Loc: Kent, WA, USA
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Quote:
Remember the idea is that more bark would be a lower number.
Um, ok ??? 
Nevertheless, the sound quality of Bubs is certainly far better than TORs. They should be at least a 7, if not an 8 (I know the SS crowd won't like that...lol).
I can still remember odatbob complimenting me on the sound of my Bubs, on a ride from Issaquah back to Renton. He had TORs on his 07 TBA.
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Blue/White 2007 TBA, Thruxton needles, Unifilter, AI removed, Polaris Bellmouth, Bubs, Nology Coils/wires, Lightbar, Ricor Intiminators, Hagon Nitros, Tall Sissy Bar w/luggage rack, Dart flyscreen & Lowers. 130 Mains.
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RamSound
Loquacious
Reged: 08/09/05
Posts: 2706
Loc: Mary Esther, FL
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Interesting, I bought my Specialty Spares because I thought they had a very "throaty" sound. The only others I've been able to compare to besides stock are Bubs and TORs. I like the sound of my pipes with new re-packed baffle material the best. As the baffles age they do get more raspy at high rpms. New baffles reduce the volume a bit but don't hurt the low end growl.
Great pipes. I hope Dale gets the company going again. Mine are 6 years old with 22,000 miles on them and still look like new. I order Moose fiberglass 4-stroke muffler packing to re-pack them.
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Bob
2005 America, 904cc BB, SS long slash cuts, UNI with NH bellmouth, jet kit with needles in top position, drilled slides, 128/45 jets, 1.5 turns out, 18/42 sprockets.
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FriarJohn
"Lighten up, Francis."
Reged: 01/11/05
Posts: 18825
Loc: East Helena, Montana
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Quote:
Nevertheless, the sound quality of Bubs is certainly far better than TORs. They should be at least a 7, if not an 8 (I know the SS crowd won't like that...lol).
I think you're still missing the point. It's not a competition. Higher numbers aren't better, just different. I think I'm going to have to change the number scale to a more descriptive continuum, like "rappy, growly, neither rappy nor deep, mellow tone, deep tone, thunderous." I need a damned thesaurus...
I like Bubs, too. Almost got some after riding behind AmyLee. Then I heard Zdenko's Specialty Spares and liked them better. Doesn't mean SS is better than Bub. Just means my subjective preference is for SS. If I somehow lose both of my sets of SS pipes there's a good chance I'd buy Bubs now that SS is out of business.
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BA.com Caretaker | Friarsride | jb.com
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The_Dog33
Fe Butt
Reged: 02/01/07
Posts: 16995
Loc: NE PA USA
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I rode with a member here once and he had BUBs, great sound but too tame for me.
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I learned all I need to know about life by killing smart people and eating their brains.
Eat right ,Exercise ,Stay fit, Die Anyway!
some shots of our bikes
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mikemm03
Loquacious
Reged: 01/13/05
Posts: 3755
Loc: Tennessee by the grace of god
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Quote:
Good meaasure of where I sit, so to speak with pipes.
I wonder if there are different TORs though. I have long slash cut TORs for my EFI Speedmaster that seem quite loud. They are straight through with baffles around the circumference. The way the TORS are referred to, you'd think they were relatively quiet. I beg to differ, even with custom earplugs they are more than loud enough.
I'd love to know how these pipes measure up with the new impending SAE J2825 tests that will be coming to some jurisdictions.
CLICKY
H.
Indeed there are, I have two set's of long slash TOR's. One on a 2003 America, one on a 2004 Speedmaster.They look identical but the Speedmaster is much louder and throatier.
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Red Devil and Hornet
It's not speeding till you get pulled over.
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Ronz32
Member
Reged: 03/29/10
Posts: 84
Loc: Scotland
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Mine aren't on the list unless you add "short TORs, gutted, 6" cut off and wrapped with stainless tips" but I would rate the loudness as "UnGodly" or possibly "Genuinely Painful On Trips Of 20 Minutes Or More Without Ear Protection Causing My Ears To Ring For About 2 Hours" but you can edit that last bit down.
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hyates
Adjunct
Reged: 11/03/09
Posts: 473
Loc: Canada
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Quote:
Indeed there are, I have two set's of long slash TOR's. One on a 2003 America, one on a 2004 Speedmaster.They look identical but the Speedmaster is much louder and throatier.
Yah, I'm taking them off the bike. These are just WAY too loud for my wife and I, even with custom fitted earplugs. Just did a 2000 km trip and at the end of a 700 km day our ears were ringing. I like my hearing.
Thanks,
H.
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2007 Speedmaster Tornado Red/Black (Hers)
2010 Speedmaster Black/New England White (Mine)
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FriarJohn
"Lighten up, Francis."
Reged: 01/11/05
Posts: 18825
Loc: East Helena, Montana
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Quote:
Mine aren't on the list unless you add "short TORs, gutted, 6" cut off and wrapped with stainless tips" but I would rate the loudness as "UnGodly" or possibly "Genuinely Painful On Trips Of 20 Minutes Or More Without Ear Protection Causing My Ears To Ring For About 2 Hours" but you can edit that last bit down.
I'm going to go with the "unbaffled anything" category here. 
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BA.com Caretaker | Friarsride | jb.com
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foglefar
Learned Hand
Reged: 03/09/05
Posts: 1975
Loc: Brisbane, Australia
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Staintunes would probably be somewhere in the lower third of the unbaffled pipes - but that's a guess. Sound quality would be a 7 or 8. Build quality would be a 10.
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Cheers, Richard
~~~~~~~~~~~~
09 America, Staintune Pipes, K&N, Breathe, Hagon Nitros, AI & O2 removed, tune 20184 (modified), MTX-L a/f gauge
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Ronz32
Member
Reged: 03/29/10
Posts: 84
Loc: Scotland
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Quote:
Quote:
Mine aren't on the list unless you add "short TORs, gutted, 6" cut off and wrapped with stainless tips" but I would rate the loudness as "UnGodly" or possibly "Genuinely Painful On Trips Of 20 Minutes Or More Without Ear Protection Causing My Ears To Ring For About 2 Hours" but you can edit that last bit down.
I'm going to go with the "unbaffled anything" category here.
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The_Dog33
Fe Butt
Reged: 02/01/07
Posts: 16995
Loc: NE PA USA
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I used to ride with a guy (my friend in prison) who had Sceptres with no baffles and both my stock cut off long cannons with no baffles and Wendy's slash cut stock pipes with no baffles were as loud or louder than his Sceptres.
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I learned all I need to know about life by killing smart people and eating their brains.
Eat right ,Exercise ,Stay fit, Die Anyway!
some shots of our bikes
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FriarJohn
"Lighten up, Francis."
Reged: 01/11/05
Posts: 18825
Loc: East Helena, Montana
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I suppose there are only so many ways you can shape the sound coming out of an empty tube.
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BA.com Caretaker | Friarsride | jb.com
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FriarJohn
"Lighten up, Francis."
Reged: 01/11/05
Posts: 18825
Loc: East Helena, Montana
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Quote:
Staintunes would probably be somewhere in the lower third of the unbaffled pipes - but that's a guess. Sound quality would be a 7 or 8. Build quality would be a 10.
Do staintunes have baffles? Are you saying they're as loud as unbaffled?
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BA.com Caretaker | Friarsride | jb.com
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FriarJohn
"Lighten up, Francis."
Reged: 01/11/05
Posts: 18825
Loc: East Helena, Montana
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Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Mine aren't on the list unless you add "short TORs, gutted, 6" cut off and wrapped with stainless tips" but I would rate the loudness as "UnGodly" or possibly "Genuinely Painful On Trips Of 20 Minutes Or More Without Ear Protection Causing My Ears To Ring For About 2 Hours" but you can edit that last bit down.
I'm going to go with the "unbaffled anything" category here.
Okay, I have a new category for you: "Custom." 
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BA.com Caretaker | Friarsride | jb.com
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foglefar
Learned Hand
Reged: 03/09/05
Posts: 1975
Loc: Brisbane, Australia
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Quote:
Quote:
Staintunes would probably be somewhere in the lower third of the unbaffled pipes - but that's a guess. Sound quality would be a 7 or 8. Build quality would be a 10.
Do staintunes have baffles? Are you saying they're as loud as unbaffled?
I am not sure you guys are meaning the same thing when you say "unbaffled". I make mufflers - all kinds, from performance systems to truck and generator mufflers.
A baffle is a plate which blocks the gas flow within the muffler. The plate has a restrictive hole which the gas must pass through.
Stock Mufflers
Stock mufflers have a series of these plates and chambers. Usually these mufflers do not have any packing (fibreglass or stainless wool) but rely totally on the series of chambers and restrictions for silencing. The gas follows a circuitous route as opposed to a direct path.
Gutted mufflers (that were baffled)
So when you totally gut a stock muffler you effectively have an un-silenced exhaust system. There is no longer any baffle plates and no packing. The empty barrel will affect the tone but otherwise it is the same as pipes with no muffler at all.
Straight Through Mufflers
These aftermarket mufflers have no baffle plates and no restrictions. The gas flows in a direct path but the tube inside the muffler is perforated and has packing (fibreglass or stainless wool) between the perf and the outer case. This system has a silencing affect as some of the gas (and sound and pressure waves) pass into the packed chamber. This is the arrangement on most aftermarket pipes. These do not have baffles. So when you say "un-baffled" you are including these mufflers.
There are also combinations of muffler design which include baffles, packing and chambers but don't really apply to this discussion.
As a side note on sound: fibreglass packing will give a deeper note than stainless wool. But stainless wool never degrades while fibreglass will need to be replaced every 2-3 years and your exhaust note (tone and volume) will change as the glass degrades. I don't recommend domestic grade fibreglass as it is not heat rated, is not in a long strand and will degrade much faster and blow out.
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Cheers, Richard
~~~~~~~~~~~~
09 America, Staintune Pipes, K&N, Breathe, Hagon Nitros, AI & O2 removed, tune 20184 (modified), MTX-L a/f gauge
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FriarJohn
"Lighten up, Francis."
Reged: 01/11/05
Posts: 18825
Loc: East Helena, Montana
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Thanks for the distinction and explanation.
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BA.com Caretaker | Friarsride | jb.com
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setamp
Complete Newb
Reged: 06/20/11
Posts: 12
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How would this list look if the sub-categories were eliminated?
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FriarJohn
"Lighten up, Francis."
Reged: 01/11/05
Posts: 18825
Loc: East Helena, Montana
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Not much different. I'm guessing that any debaffled pipe is going to be louder than the loudest baffled pipe. Factory pipes (unmodified or slightly modified) are probably going to be quieter than just about any other pipe. Problem is a lot of this is subjective.
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BA.com Caretaker | Friarsride | jb.com
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FriarJohn
"Lighten up, Francis."
Reged: 01/11/05
Posts: 18825
Loc: East Helena, Montana
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Oh, and add to that the same pipes made in different batches might be the same. Like Keith's Specialty Spares from the last batch are way louder than older Specialty Spares.
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BA.com Caretaker | Friarsride | jb.com
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JasonSonOfEd
Adjunct
Reged: 02/18/10
Posts: 538
Loc: Largo, FL
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I have long slash cut gutted stock and short TORs..guess someone is going to have to send me some BUBs and Specialty Spares and the others AND I will test them out and let you know... I will be waiting for FedEx or UPS truck 
Its just me I guess but even with the gutted stock exhaust EVEN the wind noise is LOUDER then the exhaust when I wear a half helmet!! So I am confused when people say that TORs are WAY TOO LOUD 
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Are we there YET? I gotta go pee!!
08 SpeedMASTER, Black and Red!
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setamp
Complete Newb
Reged: 06/20/11
Posts: 12
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I installed long TORS slash cuts on my 2010 America. If these are only 1 step above stock, I can't imagine how loud these other pipes must be. The TORS are plenty loud enough for me.
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Hairdoo
Adjunct
Reged: 06/11/11
Posts: 449
Loc: Haymarket, VA, USA
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I had long TOR slash cuts on my 2002 america - and I found them to be very tame - there must be different variants or something - with varied baffling.....as soon as I was in 3rd gear (going fast enough to bein 3rd gear) - the wind drowned out the pipes completely (with a half helmet).
with the 20" helix turnouts, I can hear the pipes all the way through 5th - unless it gets extra windy for some reason.
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...you're gonna feel a little pressure....
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setamp
Complete Newb
Reged: 06/20/11
Posts: 12
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I wear either a full helmet or a 3/4 helmet as well as custom ear plugs. I can hear the TORS at any speed. They are as loud as most Harleys IMHO.
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FriarJohn
"Lighten up, Francis."
Reged: 01/11/05
Posts: 18825
Loc: East Helena, Montana
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Chuck, have you changed or eliminated the airbox at all? When I put K&N pods on my first bike my short TORs really woke up at full throttle. Even now, with TORs on my second bike and only a drilled airbox with the snorkel removed, the TORs have a nice growl to them at full throttle. But I would never say they were Harley loud. Now the Specialty Spares, I call those loud (but not the loudest of course).
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BA.com Caretaker | Friarsride | jb.com
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Ryk
Learned Hand
Reged: 05/19/10
Posts: 1627
Loc: Pac. NW
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Where do Staintunes fit in all this? I saw no mention of them 
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FriarJohn
"Lighten up, Francis."
Reged: 01/11/05
Posts: 18825
Loc: East Helena, Montana
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Never heard them that I can remember. I'll have to rely on someone else' input.
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BA.com Caretaker | Friarsride | jb.com
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Ryk
Learned Hand
Reged: 05/19/10
Posts: 1627
Loc: Pac. NW
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Well I'm running a set on my traveling bike and at cruise they are very quiet with a nice civilized growl on accel. They are of complete Stainless construction and seem well built. Almost identical in noise level to the short TOR slashcuts they replaced, evidently they flow better than TOR s as I had to jet to 130 s and I'm still a froghair lean. Evidently they aren't that popular or more folks would be running them. Surprised to learn that.
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The_Dog33
Fe Butt
Reged: 02/01/07
Posts: 16995
Loc: NE PA USA
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Air box removal definately changes the sound. I can hear my pipes and Wendys too in front of me when I ride with no helmet but put my 1/2 helmet on and the wind noise drowns them out at highway speeds. We both run straight pipes as I stated before. When I wear my 1/2 helmet if I don't wear ear plugs I can't hear at the end of the ride.
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I learned all I need to know about life by killing smart people and eating their brains.
Eat right ,Exercise ,Stay fit, Die Anyway!
some shots of our bikes
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dertbikdennis
Adjunct
Reged: 03/29/09
Posts: 117
Loc: Wisconsin
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I'm not sure how loud some of these other pipes are but I have bubs and have pulled the baffles out a few times for one reason or another.... when I started the bike my eyes popped out of my head! then take it down the road and it made women and children run for cover....ridiculous !!! if your looking for attention ?? this will do it but it might not always be the attention you may want. Also this level of db's will only leave a ring in your head that won't go away ! With the baffles in these pipes are sweeeeeet sound the way this bike should sound. The nice thing is when you get where your going you can still here what everone is saying about you ... 
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If it isn't broke ...break it ! then you'll have something to do !
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edmspeedmaster
Learned Hand
Reged: 07/11/11
Posts: 1245
Loc: Alberta, Canada
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Bubs, baffles in = the bomb luvs them.
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2007 Speedmaster and lovin it!
In Memory of "Friar John" 1967-2012 RIP
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beamer
Learned Hand
Reged: 01/11/05
Posts: 1305
Loc: MINERAL WELLS TX.
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for Bub owners, try this, pull baffel, cut prferated tube at the 1/2 way mark wrap some glass just at the back end of perforation and safty wire so it stays put. It will sound throaty and deep,and plenty loud when given the gas but at idle it wont wake the neighbors. Ill be pulling them again real soon so I will take pictures.
()--:::::::::: (representing an uncut baffel) then I did this ()--**:::: the ** represent KTM fiberglass packing. its about 2" in width.
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Mal: "Y'all see the man hanging out of the spaceship with the really big gun?{ref, Jayne} Man's lookin' to kill some folk. So really, it's his will y'all should worry about thwarting."
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isk
Complete Newb
Reged: 04/19/13
Posts: 3
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Where would the bc bombers fit in?
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