Keith
Stickman Yogi
Reged: 03/21/09
Posts: 11611
Loc: BC, Canada
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Since I got my bike running the other day I've been riding pretty much full time. As I was riding today I thought hey, what can it hurt (and it just might help) to fire up the ol' Forum and talk a bit about pavement and gravel. There are basic things to watch out for, which in the end just might safe our bacon. For example:
- A paved road with gravel shoulders can be a concern. Often cagers will drift into the shoulder on a right hand corner and throw loose gravel up on the road.
- A paved road with gravel road intersections is cause for concern too. Vehicles coming off the gravel road side roads tend to drag gravel with them onto the pavement.
- Another scenario is rain. Especially in mountainous regions, rain can and does wash sand and gravel (even rock and stone) onto the surface of the paved road. A dirt driveway leading uphill from the road is where it happens a lot... the rain just washes debris onto the road. Not good.
- Finally... around here where I live in Southern BC the highway maintenance people have adopted a new practice for sealing cracks in pavement. They fill the cracks with fresh oil, then spread a sand/gravel mix gravel over top. The idea is that traffic will pound the mix into the cracks forcing it to combine with the oil. SERIOUSLY... THEY DO THIS! It makes for a stupidly dangerous and dirty surface to ride on and should be tread upon with great trepidation!
So there ya have it... some pavement/gravel concerns. In conclusion let's just say, be on the look out for any loose material on the road at any given time. Here we get chunks of bark from logging trucks, gravel, branches, rocks, pieces of tire, mud, fish, monkeys... you name it! Be care full out there. We're all in this together!! 
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Live to love, love to live.
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foglefar
Learned Hand
Reged: 03/09/05
Posts: 1975
Loc: Brisbane, Australia
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You've got some good points there Keith. It's scary to hit some gravel or loose stuff in the middle of a corner. I found doing some riding on gravel roads reduces the fear of gravel a wee bit. Gets you used to the tail weaving a bit loose and a break in traction doesn't have to mean you're going down. However - gravel on tarmac can be like ball bearings under your tires.
I can't believe the stupidity of using oil and gravel as a repair on tarmac - you couldn't get a worse combination especially if it rains. I would be telling the relevant authority their actions could result in expensive law suits.
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Cheers, Richard
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09 America, Staintune Pipes, K&N, Breathe, Hagon Nitros, AI & O2 removed, tune 20184 (modified), MTX-L a/f gauge
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cefox
Adjunct
Reged: 03/03/10
Posts: 258
Loc: kentucky usa
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I've had first hand experience with all those scenarios, plus an idiot who washed about 20 pounds or so of pea gravel out of the bed of his truck into the road, around a blind curve about 2 minutes before I rounded said curve on a fully laden 1984 Honda V 65 Magna traveling at about warp 2. That one really scared me, lol. What can I say I was young and exceedingly stupid.
They used to chip and seal the back roads here, pretty much what your talking about with the patches except they were actually replacing gravel roads, yeah the entire road. That is some slippery stuff we used to have a blast on it as kids, but, if you crash on it dry once its set up it's like scooting across a giant eraser.
EVERYONE should ride in gravel, I've found that the best street riders are typically dirt riders and people who grew up riding gravel roads, ****** I still ride gravel everyday my drive way is about a third of a mile long.
Another fun road hazard here is coal and rock dust it's especially fun if it gets wet, The Hal Rodgers Parkway is constantly covered with the stuff for about 150 miles, as if avoiding all the truck traffic from mining, quarrying and logging wasn't enough.
Hmm I'm pretty long winded aren't I? Sorry guys.
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Outside a dog a book is a mans best friend, inside a dog it's to dark to read.
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DunnSpeed
Oil Expert
Reged: 10/27/08
Posts: 2380
Loc: St. Louis, MO
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Keith and cefox,
Here in Stl they do repairs like both of you are speaking of...very dangerous. I live just outside Stl in a rural area and they repair cracks with the oil and sand/gravel method as well as repaving roads with oil and gravel. It works but it takes a loooong time for that gravel to get pounded down into anything remotely related to pavement. I think it's insane for bikes and is such a pain when they do it.
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Chris '03 Speedy.
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The_Dog33
Fe Butt
Reged: 02/01/07
Posts: 16996
Loc: NE PA USA
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Glad they don't do that sand oil thing on cracks here. They used liquid hot tar to seal cracks here. It is better but still can be slippery.
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I learned all I need to know about life by killing smart people and eating their brains.
Eat right ,Exercise ,Stay fit, Die Anyway!
some shots of our bikes
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Mango
Adjunct
Reged: 03/10/07
Posts: 383
Loc: St. Louis, MO
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The other day I turned on to one of my favorite roads only to find out that they oil and lose graveled the road. It's a little coarser than sand, big surprise, since no signs were put up. 
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Sono qui per la birra
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Hermit
Learned Hand
Reged: 01/28/07
Posts: 1475
Loc: NE FL
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1972... I was following behind a couple of friends on a Chopped Suzuki (picture a 2 stroke Easy Rider  ). Anyway, they came around the curve a little hot and there was a little kid (maybe 6) sitting in the dirt tossing gravel onto the road.  The Suki hit the gravel and they went down. Passenger Jim, decided he'd ride driver Butch 'til they stopped. Jim got up without a scratch, Butch was in a body bandage for 3 months - looked like a mummy! Catheter required because he couldn't bend either of his arms to ______! 
Needless to say, I've got a healthy respect for unexpected gravel!
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Youth, talent & enthusiasm are no match for old age and treachery.
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cefox
Adjunct
Reged: 03/03/10
Posts: 258
Loc: kentucky usa
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Another road hazard I forgot, have you ever hit a CD as you were coming to a stop? NOT FUN AT ALL. I ran up on one on my XR about 3 years ago, as soon as the front wheel was completely on the disc it stopped turning even releasing the brake didn't seem to help, but then again it was over before I could really react. Nothing like falling over at an intersection to make you feel like a squid.
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Outside a dog a book is a mans best friend, inside a dog it's to dark to read.
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cefox
Adjunct
Reged: 03/03/10
Posts: 258
Loc: kentucky usa
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Off topic I know but a road hazard is a road hazard.
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Outside a dog a book is a mans best friend, inside a dog it's to dark to read.
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Keith
Stickman Yogi
Reged: 03/21/09
Posts: 11611
Loc: BC, Canada
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Another one, well especially for us mountain dwellers.... fallen rock!! Yesterday I was running a supernatural stretch of twisties when... when suddenly around a curve (heavy lean/power on) the road was spattered across both lanes with broken rock from above!! Talk about yer obstacle avoidance!!! Luckily it was a road less traveled and I had both lanes for maneuvering. That was interesting!
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Live to love, love to live.
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roadworthy
Old Hand
Reged: 08/29/07
Posts: 8884
Loc: St Louis MO
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I'm a city rider, I have to avoid ladders and mattresses and furniture and cinder blocks and all the other things that idiots put on trailers or trucks or on top of a car and don't tie down properly.
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I stopped fighting my inner demons. We're on the same side now.
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drgnslyr
Adjunct
Reged: 09/23/05
Posts: 438
Loc: Foothills of the Blueridge Mt...
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And let's not forget wet leaves this time of year.
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Just an old Hippie and I don"t know what to do.
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Keith
Stickman Yogi
Reged: 03/21/09
Posts: 11611
Loc: BC, Canada
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Quote:
I'm a city rider, I have to avoid ladders and mattresses and furniture and cinder blocks and all the other things that idiots put on trailers or trucks or on top of a car and don't tie down properly.
WOW!! Remind me to avoid the city at all costs!
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Live to love, love to live.
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erle
Loquacious
Reged: 04/05/08
Posts: 3191
Loc: 25-22-28-0***-****0
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Quote:
Quote:
I'm a city rider, I have to avoid ladders and mattresses and furniture and cinder blocks and all the other things that idiots put on trailers or trucks or on top of a car and don't tie down properly.
WOW!! Remind me to avoid the city at all costs!
It's NOT the city, and It's NOT the mountains, and it's NOT the country. IT'S THE ROAD!!! STAY OFF THE ROADS!!! 
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And you may see me tonight
With an illegal smile
J. Prine
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roadworthy
Old Hand
Reged: 08/29/07
Posts: 8884
Loc: St Louis MO
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It's the cans! He hates these cans! STAY AWAY FROM THE CANS!!!!!!
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I stopped fighting my inner demons. We're on the same side now.
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Keith
Stickman Yogi
Reged: 03/21/09
Posts: 11611
Loc: BC, Canada
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Quote:
Another road hazard I forgot, have you ever hit a CD as you were coming to a stop? NOT FUN AT ALL. I ran up on one on my XR about 3 years ago, as soon as the front wheel was completely on the disc it stopped turning even releasing the brake didn't seem to help, but then again it was over before I could really react. Nothing like falling over at an intersection to make you feel like a squid.
Any CD would most likely cause problems but in your case that CD seemed to really bung things up. Did you check to see what was on that CD? 'Cause I'm thinkin' it was probably a CD by the London based band, 'Slim Slip & The Sliders.' That's right... their material is very slippery ya know! Here's a link of them playing some pretty fantastic Rockabilly music.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p6f0Ls1bREs
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Live to love, love to live.
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FrankW
I live in the sun downunder
Reged: 01/27/09
Posts: 1216
Loc: Queensland OZ
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Quote:
Another one, well especially for us mountain dwellers.... fallen rock!! Yesterday I was running a supernatural stretch of twisties when... when suddenly around a curve (heavy lean/power on) the road was spattered across both lanes with broken rock from above!! Talk about yer obstacle avoidance!!! Luckily it was a road less traveled and I had both lanes for maneuvering. That was interesting!
Hey Keith,
The favourite sign in Australia in hilly regions is:
FALLING
ROCKS
DON'T
STOP
If they did you wouldn't need a road sign. 
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FrankW
Ex Speedmaster rider, now on the dark side. Harley Davidson Softail Deluxe 103 cu in. and loving it.
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cefox
Adjunct
Reged: 03/03/10
Posts: 258
Loc: kentucky usa
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Yeah we have that issue here in the Bluegrass as well, but it's pretty minimal.
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Outside a dog a book is a mans best friend, inside a dog it's to dark to read.
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Hermit
Learned Hand
Reged: 01/28/07
Posts: 1475
Loc: NE FL
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Quote:
I'm a city rider, I have to avoid ladders and mattresses and furniture and cinder blocks and all the other things that idiots put on trailers or trucks or on top of a car and don't tie down properly.
Never follow pick-up trucks or utility trailers. NEVER!
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Youth, talent & enthusiasm are no match for old age and treachery.
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cefox
Adjunct
Reged: 03/03/10
Posts: 258
Loc: kentucky usa
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It was label side up, if I remember correctly it was Hank Williams Jr.. yet another reason I don't like him, I'd have really been screwed if it had been a slim slip & the sliders disc. lol.
Another major issue in my area is people riding horses on public roads especially at night, and the beauty of it is if you are involved in an accident with one in Kentucky you are pretty much at fault unless the riders is drunk or the horse has gotten out and is riderless.
I just don't get it, I'm required to tag, insure and keep functioning lights, horn etc. everything I own that is road going. but horses require no license no insurance and lighting is SUGGESTED if you are going to be out after dark.
Makes me want to go out and tear through these peoples yards and pasture fields on my XR at warp 1.5 , it is after all an off road capable bike, seems fair to me. Of course I'd drop my insurance and take the tags off, I just haven't figured out what to leave a trail of every where I go, any suggestions for a reasonable facsimile of horse poo that would be easy to carry on a bike and easy to drop a pile of every 30 feet or so.
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Outside a dog a book is a mans best friend, inside a dog it's to dark to read.
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hyates
Adjunct
Reged: 11/03/09
Posts: 473
Loc: Canada
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Good post Keith. Regarding the maintenance crew's crack sealing practices, that may not conform to Minstry Standards. I'd be lodging a complaint to the Area Manager of Ministry of Highways to look into this. I'd also copy the contractor.
A few years ago I had a similar concern with crack sealing on Hwy 3 near Keremeos. They looked into it.
ROCKY MOUNTAIN DISTRICT
129 - 10th Avenue S.
Cranbrook, BC V1C 2N1
(250) 426-1500
Jack Bennetto
District Manager
Jack.Bennetto@gov.bc.ca
Gordon Chudleigh
District Operations Manager
(250) 837-9407
Gordon.Chudleigh@gov.bc.ca
This information is here:
http://www.th.gov.bc.ca/contacts-regions.htm#SouthernInterior
H.
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2007 Speedmaster Tornado Red/Black (Hers)
2010 Speedmaster Black/New England White (Mine)
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Keith
Stickman Yogi
Reged: 03/21/09
Posts: 11611
Loc: BC, Canada
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Thanks for that info. Something to look into for sure.
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Live to love, love to live.
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FriarJohn
"Lighten up, Francis."
Reged: 01/11/05
Posts: 18825
Loc: East Helena, Montana
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Quote:
They fill the cracks with fresh oil, then spread a sand/gravel mix gravel over top. The idea is that traffic will pound the mix into the cracks forcing it to combine with the oil. SERIOUSLY... THEY DO THIS! It makes for a stupidly dangerous and dirty surface to ride on and should be tread upon with great trepidation!
And that crap sticks to your bike, which I'm sure drives neat freaks crazy. 
I hate chip-seal. They do it around here all the time. I love finding new asphalt pre-chip-seal. It's glorious.
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BA.com Caretaker | Friarsride | jb.com
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The_Dog33
Fe Butt
Reged: 02/01/07
Posts: 16996
Loc: NE PA USA
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I have to recant my statement as they have started to fill holes that way here too now.I reserve judgement until I see how it holds up. As for tar and chip road surfaces , I like them. They seem to hold up well and after a few days are fine for a bike. They do suck right after they are surfaced though.
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I learned all I need to know about life by killing smart people and eating their brains.
Eat right ,Exercise ,Stay fit, Die Anyway!
some shots of our bikes
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ssjones
Check Pants
Reged: 01/11/05
Posts: 5527
Loc: Hagerstown, MD
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Quote:
It's the cans! He hates these cans! STAY AWAY FROM THE CANS!!!!!!
Just picked that up out of the $5 bin at Wallyworld!
Back to safety- stay off the front brake on loose roadways, the rear brake is your friend. Dry it's all front brake for me.
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Al
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locopony
Loquacious
Reged: 09/01/10
Posts: 4307
Loc: Texas, Houston
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I ran over a pile of plastic saw horses once, on my way to Galveston. that was scarey at 75 miles per hour. It was at least three of them piled up in the road. In the city you may not know you are following a yahoo. he could be 20 cars up but he is there. Dropping idiot droppings every where he goes.
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Bopin in the bad shine, with a bota bag of fried wine.
http://locoponys.com/
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